posted by:
intricategirl (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (5:09 am)
I am convinced that the movie offends different people in different ways. It's like a mirror that only shows our ugly sides. And I include myself in that group.
I will say that in interviews, Sacha Baron Cohen has said that he was genuinely moved during that experience in the Pentecostal meeting. I forget the exact words, but the gist was that he was truly affected during that experience. Did he convert? Of course not. But he can understand the appeal of having people accept him no matter how dirty or strange he was, all of them praying for him.
posted by:
seochris (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (5:57 am)
Well if its ridiculing Christ and His believers then I would ignore that
posted by:
PastorDave (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (8:31 am)
Reply to: intricategirl
The movie portrays these church people in all of their strangeness. It makes them look like a bunch of backward dummies. The fact is, many educated and refined people choose to be Pentecostal in their religion. Of course, for the people at that particular worship service to invite a total stranger to the microphone to make an unrehearsed statement is to ask for trouble. It is interesting, and I am glad you made the point, that Cohen was genuinely touched by the acceptance and love of these people.
posted by:
PastorDave (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (8:49 am)
Reply to: seochris
Not a good thing, I agree.
Did you ever get around to going to see a movie? Maybe not this one, but you owe it to yourself to enjoy a big-screen film. It can be a great experience.
posted by:
doeeyed (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (9:12 am)
I haven't seen the movie so, I can't really comment.
I was raised in a Pentecostal home and attended Pentecostal Mission of Prayer church, 3 times a week, most of my childhood so, I believe I *might* be offended too. *shrug*
I think what you describe says that we are most offended by what we can most closely relate to, eh?
posted by:
intricategirl (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (9:19 am)
I've seen the movie, PastorDave. While it's certainly not true for all Pentecostals (40% do not speak in tongues,etc), the fact remains that speaking in tongues is part of the worship for many Pentecostal churches.
As far as whether it makes them look like a bunch of backwards, uneducated people, I personally don't think it does. That's just part of how some of them worship God. I've been to a Catholic service, and I find that quite bizarre, but certainly it doesn't make them look "backwards". It's just not something I understand because it's not my religion.
I don't have any clue whether he stumbled upon this group or sought them out. I suspect it's a mixture of both. Nowhere else in the movie did he try to find an extreme group to work with. The rodeo was probably the most extreme group, and I've known people just like that. I guess I'm saying that I think he just happened upon them while searching for a church group. Otherwise, if his point was strictly to make the church group look ludicrous, he could have found a group of snake-handler Pentecostals. Instead, there are members of the House of Representatives and lots of men in nice suits.
posted by:
intricategirl (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (9:28 am)
I've seen the movie, PastorDave. While it's certainly not true for all Pentecostals (40% do not speak in tongues,etc), the fact remains that speaking in tongues is part of the worship for many Pentecostal churches.
As far as whether it makes them look like a bunch of backwards, uneducated people, I personally don't think it does. That's just part of how some of them worship God. I've been to a Catholic service, and I find that quite bizarre, but certainly it doesn't make them look "backwards". It's just not something I understand because it's not my religion.
I don't have any clue whether he stumbled upon this group or sought them out. I suspect it's a mixture of both. Nowhere else in the movie did he try to find an extreme group to work with. The rodeo was probably the most extreme group, and I've known people just like that. I guess I'm saying that I think he just happened upon them while searching for a church group. Otherwise, if his point was strictly to make the church group look ludicrous, he could have found a group of snake-handler Pentecostals. Instead, there are members of the House of Representatives and lots of men in nice suits.
posted by:
bawdy (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (11:52 am)
I'd have to see the movie before I could comment as to whether he was ridiculing or just having some good natured fun at the expense of others.
posted by:
doeeyed (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (3:52 pm)
Reply to: intricategirl
I have to agree that it's all what you're accustom too. My Grandmother and two of my Aunts speak/spoke in tongues and it was all very natural to me. Of course when I brought friends to church, they would "freak out"
I don't tell a lot of folks that I was raised pentacostal, not because I'm ashamed of it but, because they don't understand and I'm not always up to explaining nor do I really feel the need to.
posted by:
lorischuster (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (4:00 pm)
I tried to go into this movie with an open mind--but, I just don't find the humor in humiliating people--even if we find them annoying. I was uncomfortable through the whole thing. It just bothered me...couldn't really find any redeeming value in it. Just my take.
posted by:
intricategirl (
reply)
post date:
03.20.07 (5:04 pm)
Reply to: doeeyed
I'm glad you understood what I meant. Sometimes it's difficult to express what you mean over the internet. :)
posted by:
inkspector (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (7:17 am)
I saw Borat (in character) on Regis and they walked through NYC. I did not like what I saw so I did not go see the movie.
I saw in the news, several of the people in the movie were suing because they were told one thing and signed disclaimers then when they edited it, it looked like something else and made them look bad. Many did not know Borat was acting and that was not his real name or accent. He also does a character (many find offensive) called Ali G, something like that.
posted by:
heavyarms (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (10:39 am)
Have yet to see it, but I want to. Though, like Lori, I can get a bit uncomfortable when the laugh is at the expense of someone unsuspecting (depending on the circumstances.) I used to feel like that, I'd laugh along at people who were different than me when they get made fun of, but poke fun at Southerners or Christianity, I'd get all up in arms.
That was back in my "younger" days. I'm now an apostle of the Church of South Park, where we believe you can either laugh at everything or nothing at all, but you can't take the middle ground. I can't laugh at Muslims and all their sillines if I can't do the same thing for Christians (and lots of Christians are WAAAAY funny.) Likewise, if its okay for us to laugh at stereotypical "white" behavior (as told by Chris Rock, or Chappelle), then it must also be okay for us to laugh at stereotypical "black" behavior. I think you may be converting.
posted by:
evilmammoth (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (11:44 am)
I've seen the movie and have watched some of the Da Ali G show where Borat originated. I fully support Cohen in what he's doing. He forced people to be honest in a way that is impossible if you are a standard American journalist interviewing these people. Those misogynist frat boy fucks deserved what they got. The Pentecostals deserved what they got (a shameless display not of acceptance, but of recruitment...getting another warrior on their side. Their fervor didn't seem sincere in the least to me). The politicians and rodeo troglodytes got what they deserved. The only (for the most part) genuinely nice people in the movie--the old Jewish couple that ran the bed and breakfast--were spared face-to-face ridicule. You could tell he didn't want to upset them and instead made behind the scenes jokes that made fun of Borat exclusively. The kind old couple was spared completely, and rightfully so.
He picks his punches, and they usually land on the people who earn them.
posted by:
PastorDave (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (4:52 pm)
Reply to: evilmammoth
I do not see how the Pentecostals were making a "shameless display of.... recruitment". They were having a closed-door meeting. The behavior may have appeared bizzarre to some, but this was not before a captive audience. Everyone present voluteered for the show. In my opinion, this man is being cruel in his manipulation of some good-hearted folk. Like so many in the liberal entertainment industry, he considers anyone he does not personally respect to be fair game for such underhanded tactics.
posted by:
PastorDave (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (4:55 pm)
Reply to: heavyarms
When humor comes to degrade, not just behavior, but the person himself- then it has crossed a moral line, in my opinion. The old adage makes sense- laugh with him, not at him.
posted by:
PastorDave (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (4:58 pm)
Reply to: inkspector
I'm thinking these silly lawsuits have no merit, especially the frat boys.
Now, if you refuse to watch Borat, you should also refuse to watch Regis. Maybe it is not as offensive, but it sure is bad entertainment! Instead, do some blogging.
posted by:
PastorDave (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (5:01 pm)
Reply to: lorischuster
You gave it a chance, which is all you should do. I have the same take on this flick by Al Gore. I'm probably going to watch it, just for the sake of debate. I've an idea: on a really bad day- rainy, off work, got the flu- why not rent Inconvenient Truth, Farenheit 9/11, and maybe Bowling For Columbine? Just go for broke, and see if you survive to blog that evening.
posted by:
PastorDave (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (5:03 pm)
Reply to: bawdy
Rent it at Blockbuster for $4.23. My son somehow came up with it. I asked no questions. Saved me $4.23.
posted by:
PastorDave (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (5:06 pm)
Reply to: doeeyed
And now I can add a bit more color, and dimension, to the portrait of Doeeyed. I discern you are no longer active in this brand of the faith? Like most Protestant groups, there are extremes that can be embarassing, but I know many Pentecostals who make fine representatives of Christianity.
posted by:
PastorDave (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (5:10 pm)
Reply to: intricategirl
I've attended Pentecostal worship services. I saw lots of emotions, lots of outward expressions of worship- speaking in tongues, being "slain in the spirit", rapid-fire foaming-at-the-mouth preaching, etc. It's not a social/worship culture that I want to frequent. But I'll not go so far as to brand it illegitimate, or inferior to the brand of faith I practice. Just very different, and for me very uncomfortable.
But I do believe Borat was seeking to ridicule these people.
posted by:
swanktrendz (
reply)
post date:
03.22.07 (8:11 pm)
I saw Borat, without knowing what it was going to be about, and found myself laughing. I think one's reaction to the movie will depend upon a) what you've heard (about Borat) prior to seeing the movie and b) your general state of mind during the viewing. I happened to be in a lazy, let's check out a video - don't care what kind, type of mood. I didn't find it offensive because it was so over-the-top. Who knows, another day, another time/frame of mind and I may have been writing letters to the producers?
posted by:
evilmammoth (
reply)
post date:
03.23.07 (8:27 am)
Reply to: PastorDave
Everyone is fair game for that kind of underhanded treatment, and rightfully so. It's the only way you'll get an honest answer out of anybody.
It's better--I think--than the conservative religion hogs marking atheists, homosexuals, and everyone who doesn't agree with their spiritual-political rhetoric down for an eternity of hellfire and demonic sodomy.
posted by:
heavyarms (
reply)
post date:
03.23.07 (11:33 am)
Reply to: PastorDave
I don't know if I would necessarily go that far. IN keeping with my religion (Church of South Park) has a lesson (episode) that teaches us that the famed "psychic" John Edward is a douche. The biggest douche in the universe, in fact. The end of the episode goes so far as to have a "Biggest Douche in the Universe" awards show where John Edward is abducted by aliens and brought to the awards ceremony. He wins...over an actual, sentient, giant alien douche. Obviously this humor is meant to degrade John Edward. Of course, in my opinion, the degredation is deserved and I don't really have a problem with it. Laugh with them...and at them if they deserve it.
